Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 2:33 pm
pwnedCheapAlert wrote:excuse this
InsideQC Forums
What does VIS do?
Page 2 of 2
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 8:41 pm
CocoT: if you're still having problems, I humbly suggest you try asking in the Mapping Help thread over on Func. Mappers and those knowledgeable with compilers, such as aguirRe himself, will respond pretty quickly and in detail about even the most obscure errors.
Also useful is to open the entire help thread and do a page search for relevant terms, because a lot of questions have probably been encountered before.
HTH
Also useful is to open the entire help thread and do a page search for relevant terms, because a lot of questions have probably been encountered before.
HTH
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:12 pm
Yes, thank you Kell, I think I'll do that 
I realize I'm bumping into what is probably all kinds of newbie problems, so it does make sense to read more about mapping and its related issues. I have always been a distant lurker of the Func Forums, but I think it's time to change that
I also realized I have to be MUCH more patient with VIS. I've taken a very basic map I had done, ripped almost everything and saw it still took a couple of hours to vis, so I'll have to make tests and let it run much longer than I thought was needed. The thing with my mod maps is that they are, by nature, a huge box (around 20% of the grid or so) filled to the brink with things, many of which are visible at almost all time... something, which I deducted was very tough not only on frame rate, but also vissing...
I'll keep you guys updated. Again, thanks a lot for the help
Note: I like the shape of your avatar!
I realize I'm bumping into what is probably all kinds of newbie problems, so it does make sense to read more about mapping and its related issues. I have always been a distant lurker of the Func Forums, but I think it's time to change that
I also realized I have to be MUCH more patient with VIS. I've taken a very basic map I had done, ripped almost everything and saw it still took a couple of hours to vis, so I'll have to make tests and let it run much longer than I thought was needed. The thing with my mod maps is that they are, by nature, a huge box (around 20% of the grid or so) filled to the brink with things, many of which are visible at almost all time... something, which I deducted was very tough not only on frame rate, but also vissing...
I'll keep you guys updated. Again, thanks a lot for the help
Note: I like the shape of your avatar!
Posted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 11:17 pm
Id seen Kell lurking around before, I was wondering when he would speak up =)
Posted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:44 am
Quark 4.07 (don't know about another versions) has a menu option to find holes in the map. It's not 100% accurate, but can help a lot if you're an absolute beginner.CocoT wrote:Wow, thanks frag.machine and Dr Shadowborg, super good pieces of advice and links. I really appreciate it!
I'll try it out again today and will keep you updated with the results.
Oh, and since I'm at it: what does "cluster with too many portals" mean? I get that error on another map
Update1 : Weird, when I try the "pointfile" thingy, I get the following, "0 point read / point at 0 0 0"... In DP, I get axes pointing to the center of the map grid. Does that mean there is no leak?
Posted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 4:16 am
CocoT, not only are the tools listed on Bengt's site but he has a good compiling error faq, http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k/tooltips.txt there as well. I looked up the cluster error, unfortunately it isn't listed as a common error and I have not seen it before.
So I took the next step and loaded the source code for txbsp, vis and light and searched for 'cluster with too many portals' with Visual Studios search in files option and the error never occurred in the source.
Edit: There was the off chance you encountered the error in game. I loaded up a few GLQuake sources and still nada.
So I took the next step and loaded the source code for txbsp, vis and light and searched for 'cluster with too many portals' with Visual Studios search in files option and the error never occurred in the source.
Edit: There was the off chance you encountered the error in game. I loaded up a few GLQuake sources and still nada.
Posted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 6:29 am
Yeah, so weird, uh? Yhe only trace I personally found of it was the following: http://www.google.be/search?hl=nl&q=%22 ... s%22&meta= , and I can't really make sense of it 
I'll definitely go through that FAQ and try Quark
I'll definitely go through that FAQ and try Quark
Posted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:48 am
I too had a quick search around for the cluster/portals error. It does seem to be a rare error to encounter.
I'm not a coder, so my experience of such errors comes from a mapping ( i.e. non-technical luddites-r-us ) perspective.
When a map is sealed and qbsp can divide not only the architectural surfaces of it, but also the volumes of space, it creates leafs. A leaf is a simple 'block' of 3D space within the map, and like a brush it cannot be concave. Where a leaf touches architecture, the surface is split. Where a leaf touches andother leaf, this is called a portal. Portals are basically the 'windows' from one volume of space in a map through to another volume of space. It is through these portals that vis 'looks'.
A cluster, as far as I know, is when several small leafs ( probably created by a concentration of detailed brushwork ) are 'clustered' together by vis so they can be handled more easily by the engine. A cluster with too many portals is probably a large, open, yet very detailed area of a map.
This is an educated guess, not fact, but it sounds likely. Large areas are possible in a map; detailed areas are possible in a map. But large and detailed areas are what a mapper generally has to avoid.
If that's what you've built, the solution I'm afraid is simply going to be reducing either the size or complexity of that area.
Hopefully aguirRe will have more specific knowledge to contribute to the problem.
ETA:
I'm not a coder, so my experience of such errors comes from a mapping ( i.e. non-technical luddites-r-us ) perspective.
When a map is sealed and qbsp can divide not only the architectural surfaces of it, but also the volumes of space, it creates leafs. A leaf is a simple 'block' of 3D space within the map, and like a brush it cannot be concave. Where a leaf touches architecture, the surface is split. Where a leaf touches andother leaf, this is called a portal. Portals are basically the 'windows' from one volume of space in a map through to another volume of space. It is through these portals that vis 'looks'.
A cluster, as far as I know, is when several small leafs ( probably created by a concentration of detailed brushwork ) are 'clustered' together by vis so they can be handled more easily by the engine. A cluster with too many portals is probably a large, open, yet very detailed area of a map.
This is an educated guess, not fact, but it sounds likely. Large areas are possible in a map; detailed areas are possible in a map. But large and detailed areas are what a mapper generally has to avoid.
If that's what you've built, the solution I'm afraid is simply going to be reducing either the size or complexity of that area.
Hopefully aguirRe will have more specific knowledge to contribute to the problem.
ETA:
It is the Sign Of KothCocoT wrote:Note: I like the shape of your avatar!