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Q1 BSP tree

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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby goldenboy » Sun Mar 01, 2015 3:48 pm

If distributing levels with textures is a problem, then any custom Quake map has the same problem... Doesn't the license say that you're allowed to create and distribute custom levels, basically?

If the vanilla map sources have gone through a map editor and compiler, I'd say they are custom Quake levels like any other.
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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby Cobalt » Sun Mar 01, 2015 5:34 pm

I agree, I dont see all the nitpicking regarding the Q1 textures. They were created to be used with the .maps they are compiled into, so if the .maps are ok to distribute then the textures also have to be included as they are nothiing without the original ID Q1 maps. Perhaps a case could be made when people bake those textures into non Quake maps, but even then we are talking about src code thats all been released to the public many years ago. What damage can be done by distributing other than further promoting that ID made this game and all its original assets?


goldenboy wrote:If distributing levels with textures is a problem, then any custom Quake map has the same problem... Doesn't the license say that you're allowed to create and distribute custom levels, basically?

If the vanilla map sources have gone through a map editor and compiler, I'd say they are custom Quake levels like any other.
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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby Spike » Mon Mar 02, 2015 6:03 am

I believe there was a promise along the lines of 'we won't sue you for redistributing these textures on the condition that its used only in registered quake' (and that the official license prohibits even this).
but I might be misremembering.
its a shame we don't have anyone well versed in law in the community, but I guess that could also be an entirely different can of worms.
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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby mankrip » Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:41 am

Cobalt wrote:if the .maps are ok to distribute then the textures also have to be included

This is the same as saying that "if the engine source is ok to distribute then the registered .pak file also have to be included".

The point is, when Quake was first released, it was impossible to run any custom content without having the full registered version of the game. This means that anyone who could play custom maps would already have paid for the exclusive textures of the registered version of the game, which is why id turned a blind eye to this problem.

There's no such problem in using the textures from the first episode, which was distributed for free.

Sure, id may still not care much about this even today... But this doesn't make copyright infringement legal.

goldenboy wrote:If distributing levels with textures is a problem, then any custom Quake map has the same problem...

Nobody said this.
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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby Cobalt » Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:20 am

Ok persuing my curiousity, I found some maps that were not "converted" but made from stracth in q3 bsp based on the ID deathmatch levels DM4 and DM5 , as someone had mentioned before.

Took some doing but got them to load in DP - mostly the original Q3 PK3 files are needed in order for the textures and other stuff to come up right.

I did notice that the scaling is MUCH larger in these q3 maps. For example, the teleports in q1bsp are about the size of the player and a bit larger. The teleports on these maps look like about 3-4 players can go through them.

Is this because in order to get beyond the 3 hull size limit in q1bsp, we have to expand everything outward a great deal?
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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby Spike » Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:15 am

probably its more a case of someone mis-remembering how tiny those maps really were.

also, quake players are quite wide/short, while q3 players have slightly more realistic proportions. with a different view height, things must get wider in order to retain the same apparent height+aspect.
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Re: Q1 BSP tree

Postby Cobalt » Tue Mar 10, 2015 4:07 pm

So is 1 quake unit in q1bsp = 1 quake unit in q3bsp?
Heres a screenshot showing the proportion difference. I think Q3 must be in the era of the Stone Giants ! :) Jack and the beanstalk ?

Image



Spike wrote:probably its more a case of someone mis-remembering how tiny those maps really were.
also, quake players are quite wide/short, while q3 players have slightly more realistic proportions. with a different view height, things must get wider in order to retain the same apparent height+aspect.
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