Quake Standards Base discussion

[Urre]

I'd appreciate if QuakeWorld engine-devs could voice problems they might see with the spec, as I have limited knowledge about QW engines.

Should there exist QW specific extensions? A couple features which I'd like to see in more QW engines are cvars to alter the prediction to a larger extent, more predicted movetypes (useful for spectators and otherwise flying players and such). Didn't QW also remove some features and builtins which had to do with monsters? Coop-mods would probably like to have these back...

[Urre]

Did a bunch of updates and cleanups, and added .md2 support to the list, no idea why I missed it.

[Spike]

The stock QuakeWorld server removed support for easy/medium/hard ent spawning, deathmatch entity spawning is the only choice. This is the spawnflags stuff. This means that true coop requires a modified server. QuakeWorld does not support the mission packs. You don't get the extra saved/scratch cvars.
Monster AI itself works fine in QW.

Stock QW also only supports dead or MOVETYPE_WALK(like) physics. No fly mode, no noclip (unless you're a spectator).

ZQuake readded these (first, anyway). They're supported properly in ZQuake/Fuhquake/ezQuake/FTE. So yes, some extensions would be good, they're just generally already implemented, we also have svc_particle!

[Urre]

If they're generally already implemented I say "great!", but it's still nice to list them in the standard.

What about prediction modifying by cvars? Is this already possible in stock?

What's svc_particle?

[Spike]

the particle builtin in NQ was removed in stock QW. This affects only
blood effects, which were made temp entities. This means that you get a much more limited choice of colours etc.
Prediction can be changed in QW as physics can in NQ. You just can't really attach any game code to it. Jump height is fixed at 270, you can add extra server side, but doing so will give a glitch each time you jump. pm_bunnyspeedcap 1 will disable bunnyhopping in zquake+fte+derivatives.

[dreadlorde]

It's a little big. I don't see the point for extensions.

[Urre]

Added a note about r_wateralpha support.

Added DP_QC_FS_SEARCH, makes sense to have together with FRIK_FILE.

Fog is only a requirement in hardware accelerated engines.

[Urre]

dreadlorde:
The checkextension system is pretty standard for any respected engine to have, so I figured it should be part of QSB. How do you mean "big"?

Spike:
How do you mean can't attach any gamecode to it?

Could jump height be added as a cvar to QW engines?

[dreadlorde]

dreadlorde:
The checkextension system is pretty standard for any respected engine to have, so I figured it should be part of QSB.

What engines have it?

How do you mean "big"?

It's rather long, and is starting to look like a real "standard" a.k.a. standard by committee.

[Urre]

What engines have it?

I've always imagined practicly all the big ones have it, but seeing you say that makes me wonder... DarkPlaces and FTE have it for a fact, and it'd be nice if people who know more than I do could list more.

Should QSB care about extensions? I always took it as a given, maybe I shouldn't? I recall LordHavoc even suggesting that QSB itself should be an extension, which was a rather cool idea in a sense.

It's rather long, and is starting to look like a real "standard" a.k.a. standard by committee.

Why thank you, I'll take that as a compliment!

[dreadlorde]

Why thank you, I'll take that as a compliment!

That's not a good thing. Standards by committees suck, for examples see POSIX, USB, XML, HTML, &c.

[mh]

Why thank you, I'll take that as a compliment!

That's not a good thing. Standards by committees suck, for examples see POSIX, USB, XML, HTML, &c.

OpenGL?

[dreadlorde]

Why thank you, I'll take that as a compliment!

That's not a good thing. Standards by committees suck, for examples see POSIX, USB, XML, HTML, &c.

OpenGL?

At least it's not DX.

[mh]

Why thank you, I'll take that as a compliment!

That's not a good thing. Standards by committees suck, for examples see POSIX, USB, XML, HTML, &c.

OpenGL?

At least it's not DX.

[Spike]

<offtopic>
opengl was not designed by a commitee, at least not originally.
The ARB arose before GL1.2, it was designed by SGI beforehand.
</offtopic>

It's a little big. I don't see the point for extensions.

This is my fear for any standard :)